MAYBEN Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 In the fall of 2010, I hired a pool company to install a safety cover on my pool as well as close it. They came while I was at work and finished everything and I paid them when I got home. In the Spring/Summer of 2011, I hired them to open my pool, which was to include removing/cleaning/folding up the cover, pulling the plugs and putting the proper fittings, adding the proper chemicals, vacuuming, priming the pump, adding de.. They came and when I went into the backyard, the cover was in a crumpled up pile and dirty, there was no sign of chemicals in the water, nothing was vacuumed at all, and was barely running.. I opened up the filter and found out that they must have poorly cleaned the filter when they closed it as the fingers had rock solid DE chunks everywhere.. I called the guy and told him what I found and he said he personally cleaned it when they closed the pool and knows it was done properly. I also informed him of the above issues and he said he was shocked and couldn't believe it. I told him I wasn't going to pay for the services as they were not performed. this discussion went on for a few months. I had not heard from him since around 12/2011 and then randomly got an invoice in that was much higher, and also tacked on an attorney fee if it wasn't paid by X date. I immediately called him and asked him about it and he said he wants to get paid. I told him again that he did not perform what he was hired to do and that I should not be paying for that, and I also asked him why he increased the amounts and whatnot. He said he periodically sent other invoices and said I ignored them, which I have not seen anything since we previously talked and told him that. After talking for 15 minutes, he said he had to go and he would call me back the next day (which is today) His invoice I received yesterday had a stamp on it saying he was going to take legal action.. Does anyone know what type of rights I have? I do not feel I should be paying him for crappy work, including tasks they didn't even complete.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewy Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 Do you want to go to court over it, or do you want to make this a learning experience, pay him and then post on every site including the BBB that he's a low down dirty POS and doesn't do the job he's billing for? I'd do the latter... Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE Mook Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 Did you take any pictures of the work that wasn't performed for proof? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAYBEN Posted July 18, 2012 Author Share Posted July 18, 2012 I don't have any proof, but nor does he that he performed as quoted.. I would prefer not to go to court as I don't know/have a lawyer and I'm sure would be costly anyways.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikegeaney Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 Go down to your local courthouse and file a lawsuit in small claims court. Call his bluff. Most people/small companies do not retain legal counsel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewy Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 Go down to your local courthouse and file a lawsuit in small claims court. Call his bluff. Most people/small companies do not retain legal counsel. You can call his bluff, but be ready for him to lay his cards out... He may surprise you! If you don't mind posting it, how much are we talking here? $1000, $200, $500 bucks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70'sChevyGirl Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 I wouldn't pay him. Make an online complaint with the BBB. I have had much success getting things done just by informing them of a problem and they notify the company. Normally the company doesn't want that on their records and they will fix the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAYBEN Posted July 18, 2012 Author Share Posted July 18, 2012 You can call his bluff, but be ready for him to lay his cards out... He may surprise you! If you don't mind posting it, how much are we talking here? $1000, $200, $500 bucks? the bill I got yesterday was $400-500 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3PedalMINI Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 You know i am a business owner, i have been on jobs where assholes like this guy get away with murder. Contractually he did "perform" the work, even though it sucked. Any court is going to side with him. I was on a job site where the pool builder walked off the job, he ended up getting paid for the entire thing because the court ruled in his favor. Your SOL man there are actually more laws in place to protect the contractor then there is to protect the homeowner. Also because he "performed" the work going to consumer affairs isnt going to do squat. Filing with the BBB is a waste of time, its a useless entity and a waste of money for a company to "be on there" even if you do a search for a company they never pop up. The best i can tell you is pay up, then post on every review site including google about the sleezy job he did. Angies list pulls its own weight too, sign up for them and write a review their. But dont bother with the BBB. Im actually going through the oposit right now, a @$$hole customer is threatening me with poor reviews everywhere because I wont give into his request to upgrade his AVR. RC: WOW internet blackmail at its finest, what to do? (Page 1 of 4) one call into my lawyer and i havent heard from him since, my lawyer wants me to press charges against this turd for slander/blackmail and make an example out of him, especially with the media but im still on the fence about doing so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70'sChevyGirl Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 ^^^^I disagree about the BBB. ^^^^ Contact them. It worked for me 3 times so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill-V8V Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 I had really good luck with the BBB the one time I used them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Xtreme07ss Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 I've used the BBB and Consumer Affairs in NJ. Consumer Affairs actually did more for me than the BBB did to resolve the problem I had with a Chevrolet dealer in Pitman, but both agencies did their part. It's free and you have nothing to lose by contacting both agencies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marylander Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 Pay him in pennies, dropped on the floor or counter in the lobby of his store. Preferably on a Saturday am, when there are other consumers around. A nice line like "your company left a huge mess in my yard, I thought I'd return the favor." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3PedalMINI Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 I've used the BBB and Consumer Affairs in NJ. Consumer Affairs actually did more for me than the BBB did to resolve the problem I had with a Chevrolet dealer in Pitman, but both agencies did their part. It's free and you have nothing to lose by contacting both agencies. It would be worth a shot with the consumer affairs, that would pull more weight then the BBB as they have the ability to pull their license. but seeing how you dont have any proof your really SOL, hes got more proof then you just buy having an invoice and a record showing that he sent someone out to "preform" services. Even by leaving something on your door is pretty much the same as a "signed" bill.... BTW: i assume you mean Elkins? those sleezballs went out of business, the building is still vacant. Their other location in marlton is still named elkins but some dude bought them and wiped out their entire staff and replaced them with "OK" peeps. My dad bought a car their once, was one of the worst experiences he had ever had Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02Xtreme07ss Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 It would be worth a shot with the consumer affairs, that would pull more weight then the BBB as they have the ability to pull their license. but seeing how you dont have any proof your really SOL, hes got more proof then you just buy having an invoice and a record showing that he sent someone out to "preform" services. Even by leaving something on your door is pretty much the same as a "signed" bill.... BTW: i assume you mean Elkins? those sleezballs went out of business, the building is still vacant. Their other location in marlton is still named elkins but some dude bought them and wiped out their entire staff and replaced them with "OK" peeps. My dad bought a car their once, was one of the worst experiences he had ever had It was indeed Elkins. Yes, they were terrible to deal with in every way, shape, and form. I bought my Xtreme there, it was a lease return. I should have walked away during the negotiations, but didn't because I really wanted this truck. It had everything I wanted, was low mileage, and the minor things that weren't right, wouldn't require much to address. That's when the real problems started. They started refusing to honor some of the 'we owe' work/parts and that's when I went to Consumer Affairs and the BBB. In the end, they ended up paying me out list price and posted labor rates for all the 'we owe' and I did the work myself. Work was done right and I was well compensated for my time doing it. I'm glad to hear they went out of business. I can only hope the location in Marlton eventually does the same. The BBB did follow what Consumer Affairs was working on, but opted to allow them to handle the complaint to completion. Sorry for the hijack Mayben. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueGenCoupe Posted July 18, 2012 Share Posted July 18, 2012 If you took pictures and kept proper documentation, I would call your local new paper and have them write a story on this whole situation,,,bad publicity for this contractor is the only thing you can do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAYBEN Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 No pics.. No proof really.. No call tonight either, I'll have to call him tmw during the day or on Friday.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marylander Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Honestly, I'd say that since its dragged on this long he really does hold all the cards. Maybe you can get him in a good mood and rationalize with him; say maybe something like "look, this job didn't go well, it wasn't completed to my satsifaction, what do you say I pay you 75 percent of the bill, keep off the review sites, and we leave it at that?". My joking suggestion above (with the pennies) might feel good, but at the end of the day it’ll be a lot more relaxing to just get this behind you and move on -- no sense in letting it keep you worked up and ruining future days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAYBEN Posted July 19, 2012 Author Share Posted July 19, 2012 I liked your other idea, but IIRC he's in South Jersey.. I'll see about negotiating.. I just hate to compensate someone for not completing their task.. If I did this at work, I wouldn't get paid, I would get canned.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1FAST SS Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Sucks that you don't have pics. Going to be tough without documentation on how the job turned out. I would involve my local news station. In my area they bring the pain to bad businesses. Hope it works out for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colodude18 Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 What I would do is send him a formal letter (registered) in which you say you have proof of the bad work (just bluf) and that unless they make the invoice go away, you are well within your rights, on top of legal action, to report your bad experience to the BBB, and whatever other online rating service. I think he won't take a chance with the bad publicity and will let it go. If not, you'll at least have a record of your complaint and proof that it was delivered. Without that the courts might rule in his favor when at least appearances are they kept sending invoices and you never responded in any way. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFairbanks Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 IMO, it all comes down to he said, she said from what I can tell. He claims he has sent all these invoices, to you without response you say you haven't gotten any. In reallity if they weren't sent certified mail they weren't sent. Kind of off topic I have a buddy at work that always sent his mortgage on time but was always getting hit with late fees. Started sending them certified mail and the fees went away. My experience with the BBB was a waste of time. I know some say it worked for them and that is fine. You just have to decide what works for you. My lesson was I won't waste my time next time. And actually there was a next time, and I came out ahead. I would just ignore his bill and see where it goes. But be prepared to fight if need be. Maybe tell him to direct all communication to your attorney that will be handling the issue, and pull a name out of your hat. If he calls back and says he has no record of you being a client. Tell him that you haven't gotten around to contacting him as of yet. He is probably trying to bluff/bully you. For me I have an upper hand when it comes to people like this. I get an attorney as part of my benefits package, and he is good. Doesn't cost me anything. This story reminds me of the lady on my route that had some lawn guy kill her lawn. Litterally. Looked like a two year old ran a drop spreader over it in a random manner. He had the nerve to send her a 200 and something dollar bill. Said he wanted his money. She told him forget it, and never heard from him again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFairbanks Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 (edited) No pics.. No proof really.. No call tonight either, I'll have to call him tmw during the day or on Friday.. I wouldn't even bother calling him. He may realize your not just going to roll over and may just leave you alone. If you call him, he may think that he has you feeling nervous and may have an opportunity. Edited July 19, 2012 by LFairbanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
novicetyer Posted July 19, 2012 Share Posted July 19, 2012 Here’s my story on having a pool installed. We select a local installer thru a pool store, met with him, selected the pool we wanted, got on his schedule for installation, he came out on time and installed the pool using good materials and equipment, and setup the forms for the pool deck to get ready to pour the concrete pool deck. At this point we are totally satisfied with the work that has been completed, BUT this is where the story goes from good to bad. The guy sets the forms up, but never comes back to pour the concrete, after two weeks I give him a call and ask when is he going to pour the concrete and he tells me the next day, the next day comes and no concrete, I call him back and he tells me that something came up and would do it the next day, I come home the next day and no concrete, this goes on for the next week or so and we still don’t have any concrete poured for the pool deck. I finally have enough and tell him that if he doesn’t have it poured by a specific date that I will do it myself. He never showed up to do the work, so my neighbor and I pour the pool deck ourselves. After a couple of weeks, I get a bill in the mail from the pool guy wanting the rest of his money for installing the pool, which included the price of concrete and labor for poring the pool deck. I told him I would pay the final amount, minus the cost of the concrete, but he wasn’t willing to settle for the revised amount. A few days later, I get a call at work from my neighbor that the pool guy was at my house and that I should get home fast (I work ½ hour drive from home). By the time I get home, he’s gone along with the pool pump, filter, step hand rails and deep end ladder. In order to get the stuff he took, he knocked down my chain link fence and used a knife to cut the hoses on the pump and filter. I called the police and filed a report, but the officer said he wouldn’t do anything to the pool guy due to contractual agreements. We contacted a friend who is a lawyer and talked with her on our options. Option 1 was to file a small claims case. Option 2 was to let it go and learn a lesson on dealing with contractors and replace the parts ourselves out-of-pocket. After deciding not to waste any more money on lawyers and time not having the pool running (it was mid July by this time) and we wanted to use the pool, we opted for option 2 and to tell everyone that we know our story, so that this guy will not get any more business. Come to find out the pool guy had a least two or three other pool installations going at the same time as ours and he would get to a certain point (like ours) and take his sweet time on finishing, knowing that most courts would side with him instead of the homeowner if things went south with the installation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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