? 4 black car owners that used a PC

[MitsukiGT]

I did a test spot on my black sierra today witht he PC.

 

First I started with orange pad + SHR, followed by white + FMP.

 

Results looked really good except in the sunlight there are lots of tiny scratches from the pads. These scratches I speak of are only seen in the sunlight, can't see them with halogens.

 

So I'm thinking the scratches might be swirls not removed. So next on the same spot I went with the Yellow pad + SHR, then orange pad + shr, then white + FMP. I didn't see any difference, those tiny scratched are still there.

 

I remember somone telling me about the PC and black cars, but for the life of me I can't locate that thread.

 

So what is the trick to making this paint flawless in the sunlight? Work the white pad forever?

 

Just for reference you can see it remove the swirls\scratches, but leaves tiny scratches that don't match up to where swirls were. In the pictures you can't see the leftovers that I speak of, but they are there in the sunlight.

 

(orange spots are not on paint, the camera lense is dirty)

 

before

 

after

[Marylander]

I have no advice on working on a black car, but I'd say you're getting there... the difference so far is great.

[mcss383]

Best advice I can give is do the orange+shr A LOT, that is what is has taken for me to get rid of scratches/swirls on black. Also make sure that you clean out your pad when it gets gunked up and use clean polishing MF towels (good ones like Adams).

 

Besides that, as long as you follow the instructions for SHR+PC you will get there, but black is a pain as you are finding out.

 

Have I mentioned recently that I love my new silver daily? lol

[Bill-V8V]

A black car is no different than any other car painted in the last 20 years. You are working on the clear coat not the base color. The difference is that the defects are easier to see on a darker color. Keep working, your going in the right direction

[MitsukiGT]

OK, I give up. I've been working this area for over an hour now again today. I have no idea what I am doing wrong. Now that it is seen at 1pm in direct overhead sun this thing looks hideous! Sure it removes the larger swirles, but in this sun it almost looks worse because the PC pads are putting millions of tiny scratches in it that werent there before.

 

I've tried more product, less product, more pressure, less pressure, all different speeds, etc, etc......

 

I'm to the point where I'm going to call and find out how much to get this thing painted again. There are already spots that need repainted anyway. And yes, I know it will be very expensive to do. But this isn't my DD (5K in 3 years) and I want it showroom perfect.

 

On my G8 which is pacific slate I spent 30 minutes TRYING to find these scratches, I can't!

 

I'm out of ideas, I really want to make this work, but spending hours without results isn't fun. I don't mind putting in the time if I was getting results.

 

In the videos with the black ferarri and black excursion Adam works those areas 10 times faster than I am. So surly I am working them long enough?

 

I wouldn't think my pads are dead, only did 1 car and cleaned them every night. Orange shows some wear, but white looks perfect.

Edited September 19, 2009 by MitsukiGT

[xlr8rvette]

I'm with you..... Used PC on white car for first time. No problem. Then did black Vette. Had lots of problems. Finally after several months of adding more Adams products by hand it is better. Will never use PC on black Vette again.

Edited September 19, 2009 by xlr8rvette

[Superdutytd]

Have you watched the Junkman's videos? His videos really walk you step by step through the process of getting everything perfect.

[MitsukiGT]

I gave up for the day, great weather and lots of time, but right now I'm better off doing nothing.

 

I did play a little more. I was trying to think back realy hard on how the experience went with my car. I remember the polish\shr stayed kinda wet the entire time I wored it. On my truck after 1 pass this stuff was dry, 2 passes and the product was gone. So I then tried ALLOT of product, and I mean allot. In terms of pea sized drops like 100+ for the area. I was able to get 4 passes in before it started to get dry. This did improve results by 50%, but still far from perfect.

 

At that point I gave up and have been at the computer every since hoping some advice would be given. I bought a backup orange pad that should be here monday, maybe i'll wait until then to try more. Which sucks because I have the weekends off work. Weekdays I have to stay up until midnight to get any quality time working on them.

 

SO what was your by hand process and products that got these scratches out?

[Superdutytd]

It is almost impossible to get perfect results doing this by hand.

[MitsukiGT]

Have you watched the Junkman's videos? His videos really walk you step by step through the process of getting everything perfect.

 

 

Yes, about 5 times, and this is my second vehicle I'm doing this on. The first using this same process turned out perfect, but it isn't black. I can't find any flaws in my first car.

 

These small scratches would be all that bad but it makes the paint look hazy and not black when sun hit is. In the sun from 10 feet away the paint looks flawless, but hazey and not black, almost dusy looking. I can see the scirles from spots not worked yet. So I would just live with it if not for this nasty haze the little scratches produce.

 

I'm thinking of just getting some wax on it to protect it and try again some other time. I'm just wasting my time withthe PC at this point.

[Superdutytd]

That sounds really weird, I wonder if there is something wrong with the paint.

[MitsukiGT]

I'm beyond frustrated at this point. So I'll take the day off and try again tomorrow. I PMd Dylan and Adam so hopefully they will see them before tomorrow and I'll have more stuff to try.

[Superdutytd]

You know when looking back at your after pics that paint doesn't seem to have a 'clear' clearcoat. Do you notice a lot of orange peel in your paint?

[MitsukiGT]

Yes, it is orange peeled really bad.

 

I'll get more pics up in about an hour, waiting for batteries to charge.

[Bill-V8V]

The color really has nothing to do with it. The clarecoat is not the same on every vehicle. Just because a process worked perfectly on one vehicle doesn't mean that it will work perfectly for every vehicle. Like you said, this is only the second vehicle you have ever polished, take a deep breath and relax. Tomorrow is another day

 

A good nights rest and a fresh start might be all that's needed to get things going in the right direction again :rockon:

[Superdutytd]

I'm wondering if the bad orange peel is causing the haziness he is talking about?

[Bill-V8V]

It could be but from the picture below it just looks like marring that should come out with the White Pad / FMP and the PC set on 5. The GM trucks seem to have a much harder clear than a G8, chips real easy too , you really need to take your time and move the PC slow.

[MitsukiGT]

OK, so it is your opinion that it is the white pad I need to work more? If so, then I have something I can build on. RIght now I am just guessing at which pad I need to work more, been yellow\orange\white many times now....

 

Hopefull the information, pictures and video I am posting now will help you guys tell me what to do.

 

I am getting all the large swirles out, it just leaves millions of micro scratches from the pad.

 

Here is a photo that kinda shows the marks, but I just couldn't get the camera to focus in tight enough to see. I tried a new area this time and this area was worked well over an hour.

 

 

Here is a photo (kinda out of focus) that shows the area I worked and an area I didn't. From this angle the area I worked looks lawless. But in the previous picture oyu can see that is far from the case.

 

 

Here is my pads, are they still good?

 

And finally I tried to make a video, it still don't show the haze and millions of scratches, but you can see some. I need to find a real video camera, this is just my point and shoot camera.

 

This is the first video I ever made and the stupid software added some crappy music and I have no idea how to get it off, so just mute it. IN the video I am moving from the area I worked to the area I didn't, I worked the area on the right, mostly mast the crease in the hood.

 

<EMBED src=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04D53UCC_OY&hl=en&fs=1& width=425 height=344 type=application/x-shockwave-flash allowfullscreen="true" allowscriptaccess="always"></EMBED>

Edited September 20, 2009 by MitsukiGT

[xlr8rvette]

Yes, about 5 times, and this is my second vehicle I'm doing this on. The first using this same process turned out perfect, but it isn't black. I can't find any flaws in my first car.

 

These small scratches would be all that bad but it makes the paint look hazy and not black when sun hit is. In the sun from 10 feet away the paint looks flawless, but hazey and not black, almost dusy looking. I can see the scirles from spots not worked yet. So I would just live with it if not for this nasty haze the little scratches produce.

 

I'm thinking of just getting some wax on it to protect it and try again some other time. I'm just wasting my time withthe PC at this point.

 

 

 

This is the same experience I had just over a year ago. The junkman videos were not available at that time, however, I watched others that were available. I did get 90% of the swirls out. Since then I have used Adams hand products to get the Vette looking much better. I still have marring (?)around the edges of the hood. The Hazing has been mostly overcome especially with the glaze and another brand of Carnuaba....my next task is to use the Americana by hand on the Vette which I have recently used with great success on my other 3 cars....While the PC machine method may work for many from my limited experience it is not as easy as many make it out to be especially on black, and I recommend seeking hands on training before attempting. Sorry but it didn't work for me on the black car

[Superdutytd]

Your pads are still just fine and in fact look pretty much brand new. It is pretty hard to tell how bad the damage there is. I would try going over it with the Orange/SHR a few times until those are gone.

[MitsukiGT]

 

LOL, not sure what else to say than help. Not sure how many times I need to fail before I throw in the towel, but I am close.

 

I tried this time working the orange pad for 30 minutes, adding more product when necessary. I checked periodically and the scratches never really looked any different the entire 30 minutes after the initial few passes. I kept working the orange as it was recommended I work the orange a long time, so I tried that.

 

Then I tried working the white for 30 minutes. First I worked the area 10 minutes on speed 5. It seemed to get out all the crap the orange pad mad, but still leaves millions of pad scratches.

 

Fine, so I tried speed 6 with white for 10 minutes, checking the paint every pass. Not much change if any.

 

So I work another 10 minutes with white on speed 5. Checked every pass, no change that I could see.

 

DO I really need to work the white and orange pads longer than 30 minutes each? This is getting rediculous.

 

I also tried the above step starting with yellow pad and ended with the same results.

 

Dylan, you out there? He has a chevy truck so I assume his process would be close to what I need. How long do you work each pad?

 

Thanks

[rwisejr]

How much product are you using ? How much pressure are you applying? How fast are you moving the polisher ? How large of an area are you working ?How long are you working the product ?These are the 5 key questions that need to be answered

Edited September 20, 2009 by rwisejr

[Adam]

LOL, not sure what else to say than help. Not sure how many times I need to fail before I throw in the towel, but I am close.

 

I tried this time working the orange pad for 30 minutes, adding more product when necessary. I checked periodically and the scratches never really looked any different the entire 30 minutes after the initial few passes. I kept working the orange as it was recommended I work the orange a long time, so I tried that.

 

Then I tried working the white for 30 minutes. First I worked the area 10 minutes on speed 5. It seemed to get out all the crap the orange pad mad, but still leaves millions of pad scratches.

 

Fine, so I tried speed 6 with white for 10 minutes, checking the paint every pass. Not much change if any.

 

So I work another 10 minutes with white on speed 5. Checked every pass, no change that I could see.

 

DO I really need to work the white and orange pads longer than 30 minutes each? This is getting rediculous.

 

I also tried the above step starting with yellow pad and ended with the same results.

 

Dylan, you out there? He has a chevy truck so I assume his process would be close to what I need. How long do you work each pad?

 

Thanks

 

 

Mitsuki, (Is that your first name?) I'm really sorry you are experiencing such difficulty. Sometimes, it seems the person/product/vehicle combos just don't work out.

 

(I tried to learn how to play the bass guitar, and after endless lessons, threw in the towel. I am simply not wired to be a musician. That I can live with, and instead, I ride bikes for kicks.)

 

Mitsuki, have you watched these videos, and did you use a similar method when using the PC on your vehicles?

 

http://www.adamsforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1868

 

http://www.adamsforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3666

 

If you watched these videos, followed them to a 'T' and are still experiencing the results and frustrations, maybe it's time to hire a professional detailer to dial your cars in?

 

We have a 110% unconditional satisfaction guarantee, and since I've read all of your posts, every one is one of dissatisfaction. That's not typical, as we know from reading the posts of fellow black vehicle owners here on the forum.

 

If you re ready for us to refund you for your products, and then use that $$ to have your vehicle professionally detailed, that may be a good next step.

 

Please contact me personally, as it seems time to move to the next level, and bring in a pro.

 

Again, I apologize you have had such a poor experience with our goods.

 

Very sincerely,

 

Adam

(303) 718-9480 / Cell

Adam@AdamsPolishes.com

[MitsukiGT]

Sigh... not exactly what I wanted to hear. I don't want to hire someone else, I don't want a refund, I don't want to throwin the towel. Am I really that much of a problem customer you would rather give my money back? Not that I don't appreciate that, but I bought the product to do this myself and not hire someone else.

 

Obviously black cars can be done with the PC, I seen people on here who have done it. Maybe one who done this successfully can help?

 

I did my G8 and love the results. Is it too much to ask to get these results on my black sierra?

 

Is there not a single person here that owns a black DM truck that can tell me a baseline?

 

It isn't the product that is the problem, I AM NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT THE PRODUCT!!!! With that said, I just need the proper tecnique. THe process is what is getting messed up here. I am not bashing your product and don't want a refund!

 

The videos make this look like a piece of cake. Can't believe I am too stupid to use this stuff. Like I said my G8 was easy after I learned how to use the product and the process. Using this same process works OK on the black truck, but I can never get rid of the swrils the pad makes.

 

For my process:

 

1. Work in roughly a 2'x2' area.

2. I apply pressure like in Adam's second video (with ford truck), so whatever that pressure is I am close to it.

3. I use 3 pea sized drops, but later found using more product reduced the swirles.

4. I move about the speed Adam was moving in that video. I tried slower and faster as well.

5. I work the product until it looks lke vasoline or a grease, it wipes off easily if I work it this long, if I work it less, then I have a hard time wipoing it off, which I undersand is a sign the product wasn't worked long enough.

 

6. Yes, Ive said this many times now that I have watched all the videos multiple times.

 

I'll say it again, I'm NOT TRYING TO GET A REFUND, I WANT TO LEARN how to use this on my black truck. Reading other posts I am not the only one who is having trouble on a black vehicle.

 

What process removes these tiny pad marks? Should I see them after the orange pad?

 

Note: When I use CAPS it is not yelling, it is stressing a point :-)

 

Thanks for your time

[Marylander]

This may seem like a dumb question, but are you sure there's nothing (dirt, etc) in the pads that might be creating just as many fine scratches as you're trying to remove? Or are you detailing in an area where dust or something might be getting on the finish between steps?

 

Rich

 

PS -- I know your frustration -- my Vette is dark blue and despite many tries I still haven't gotten it looking as good as the Junkman's (which is the same color). I know I need to keep working on the process and technique, but in the meantime I'm happy with the fact that it still looks 5X better than when I first got the car (used) and that it looks far better than most Corvettes you see out there.

Edited September 20, 2009 by MarylandTDI

[Team Adam's]

Man I just don't know what to say... theres obviously some kind of disconnect here b/c it shouldn't take this much effort/time to get one area perfect unless theres something else we're missing.

 

The paint on your sierra won't be any different than whats on my TBSS... its GM onyx black... now black is a real ***** to work with b/c it will show every last little itty-bitty defect and to a point you have to define your desired level of perfection. Mine is daily driven... I used to drive myself batty trying to keep it PERFECT, but its just not realistic, especially on black. Is it aoubt 90% perfect? Yes... 100%? No.

 

Now I know originally you mentioned that it hadn't been really all that well cared for from the getgo... it was garaged, but it certainly wasn't "detailed" there is a distinct possibility that in that stretch there was damage introduced that isn't correctable by the PC. With no wax protection on virgin paint some swirls can be even too deep to kill with the PC... in those cases its best to either learn to live with the minor imperfections or take it to a professional well versed in wet sanding/rotary buffing.

 

Now I'm not saying this is for sure what you're dealing with, but if you're following AJ's techniques from the video, attempting multiple passes, and still ending up with a result that you're not satisfied with that might be what we're dealing with here.

 

In any event its really hard to define exactly what the problem is b/c from the pictures you posted I don't see what you're talking about.