Hard clear coat vs the pc 7424xp

[Jonothon]

Im a detailing newbie and I recently got the Adam's Complete Porter Cable 7424 XP Polisher Kit, a nice block of time where I was only moderately interupted, and after watching all the how to videos from Addams and the Junkman (or is that THE Junkman??) and decided to do the full exterior detail on my candy white VW Passat.

 

My clear coat is .. hard. I'm wondering if I should invest in the focus pads or step up to the Flex.

 

I've spent hours on just the hood and never did get rid of the scratches and artifacts. After many more that 3 passes with the SS&H and the green pad, they are diminished but still there.

 

Since this my first time doing this, I tend to suspect my lack of experience but I have since determined that my VW clearcoat is pretty hard from visiting VW sites.

 

So... do you think the focus pads will work for me on the PC or should I just go with the Flex?

 

By the way, I spread the polish with the speed setting on 1 and the PC was ALL over the place. I had to really hold on to it tightly while at the higher speeds it was completely controllable and comfortable. Is this the norm?

[davidg]

From your description it sounds like you are using improper technique to me(pretty novice though). Did you watch junkmans speed of movement videos? You are probably trying to do the work instead of letting the machine work for you. The PC shouldn't be jumping around at all. Are you using the handle? Might have it tilted causing it to jump.

 

The 4 inch pads will take forever to work any amount of large area and I suspect they could do more harm than good since they heat up quickly and are harder to control. Watch more videos and check to see if there are any dealers/detail clinics in your area for more info!

 

Welcome to the forum! :hello: Hopefully you can get the VW back in tip top shape. I did part of the GFs Volvo with S&H and it was noticeably different with only one section pass. (also super hard clear)

[Jonothon]

Thanks for replying davidg. Yes, I saw both Adam and Junkman's video about spreading the polish/etc with the PC at setting 1. It looked effortless and I assure you, the reason I had to hold onto it was to keep it flat. I was really surprised the first time it happened and I'm afraid I gave into Keanu Reaves favorite line... whoa.

 

This is my first time with the PC and I'm suspecting mostly my skills for a fact. One thing I did notice was that it was really hard to keep in a 2'x2' area. At one point as I was getting tired, somehow it got to 3.5'x3.5 area. But that only happened just before I took a break.

 

The Focus pads would be for tackling the scratches only and not doing the whole car.

 

I would rather go with the focus pads if they will work than chin the cost of the Flex, but I welcome any input as the best way to go.

 

Edit: I DID catch myself going much too fast at times and after so many passes the pad might have been getting clogged. But still, I just couldn't get rid of those stupid scratches.

Edited April 24, 2012 by Jonothon

[davidg]

Tape a 2x2 area. get it perfect and from that point determine how long you'll be spending on the car. Benz have pretty hard clear. If you haven't checked it out yet take a look at the (lengthy) junkman slow cut method. I think it will be the most informative to your particular situation.

 

 

I just realized you said scratches and artifacts in your first post. Can you feel the scratches with you nail? Can you be more specific with artifacts?

[dipolley]

First off, WELCOME! You have found the most helpful bunch of detailing nuts on the planet. We will get you straightened out.

 

First, get rid of the handle on the PC. I find that people, especially noobs, tend to rely on it far too much and without realizing it put presure on the handle. This will cause an uneven pad on the surface. Place your hand on the top of the PC wrapping your fingers forward. Then place the weight of your hand plus a tiny bit more. This is all the presure you need.

 

The PC is a great tool for anyone learning to detail; it is very forgiving. However, ot will not get your paint absolutly perfect as it is a limited machine. You can get about 85-90% the way there. As David suggested, get a 2-foot by 2-foot area perfect. If you are using the SSR and the green pad, remember you need to step down. Don't base perfection on the most-abrasive step. The green pad a Servere Swirl Removal is fixing problems but it does produce microscratches that the Swirl and Haze Remover and orange pad will remove. You have to get down to the fine machine polish and white pad before you can make that assesment.

 

With the PC you must be patient. It take 3 times as long to fix things than the Flex, add in your skill level and you will take some time. This is an artform that requires practice. The PC is your brush. Practice. Once you get used to the way the PC operates, you can predict and feel when something is wrong and adapt before you have a problem.

 

Did you get the pad cleaning brush yet? It is a big help in keeping your pad from clogging.

[Pureshine]

VW paint is not that hard I have a 2009 GTI. You have to work the polish till it breaks down normally 5 or 6 passes should be enough. Slow movement speed and over lap by 30%-50% every pass.

[Jonothon]

I didn't try to feel the scratches at first (noob) but after all the time I put in, when I finally had to move on, I honestly couldn't feel anything with my finger or my nail, but they were, every single one of them, still visible.

 

Since I posted, I thought of all the things that I could be doing wrong and first of those is when you watch an expert do something, they make it look effortless and easy, so my expectations might be suspect. Many things I could have done wrong like the amount of product for correction, maintaining the correct pressure on the PC, keeping the work space small to keep the polish from flaring too soon...

 

This detailing thing is harder than it looks, but it might be pretty good therapy when its not driving you crazy ... seriously at one point, I was going to get a scratch out, ANY scratch out, even if I HAD TO USE THE POWER OF 10,000 SUNS. At that point, I was called in to eat and I cooled off some.

Edited April 24, 2012 by Jonothon

[Pureshine]

Just take your time and practice you will get.

[dipolley]

Oh yes, it is therapy for 90% of us and cheaper than a psyciatrist.

[Pureshine]

Yes therapy for me that turned into a business.

[Jonothon]

So much to learn.. Thank you dipolley, davidg, and pureshine for your suggestions and support.

 

I have a couple of white toyotas to practice on next time I have a block of time and they are in crappy condition so there is no way I can make them worse than they are at the moment.

 

By the way, I just wanted to let everyone know that out of all the possible products to buy, I'm happy to go with Adams for a number of reasons:

 

*Adam's support for American made products

*Adam's customer support with the videos and his customer service

*Adam's attention to detail in the development of his products that make it easy for the newcomer and the pro to use his products intuitively.

[indyb6]

Can I please bring this thread back?

 

Like OP, I also have a VW Passat but instead of being Candy White, it is Mocha Brown. It looks brown in bright light and almost black in low light. I bought a PC Kit and tried to correct the hood of my car.

 

Even after doing 4 passes with SSR, SHR and FMP, I could not get any scratches out. I tried using no pressure (just enough to let the pads touch the paint and let the PC perform both rotation and oscillation), some pressure and then some more pressure. In no case did I apply enough pressure to let the pads "barely move".

 

I don't know if its my technique, or if its the clear coat on my car, but I need some help from fellow VAG owners on what techniques / how many passes / what products and in which order do they use their products to get desired results.

[DTrem13]

A lot of newer cars have hard clear coats. So you won't be able to get ALL swirls out of your paint with the PC. I made the assumption you could a few weeks back. I wasn't successful. So in the future I'm going to invest in a FLEX.

 

Don't get me wrong, the PC is great. It only left a few swirls that weren't coming out, and the car still looked fantastic afterward. You really can't see the swirls unless you're really close. It's a great beginner tool for sure. You just won't get 100% perfection with it.

[LFairbanks]

Polishing with the Porter Cable Detailing Video

[Jonothon]

Short of getting a Flex, I'm going to try the 4" focus pads since my scratches and such are not widepread on the hood. If the whole hood, trunk, top were messed up, then the Flex would be the best solution.