A friendly reminder...

[Team Adam's]

Our rules here at AdamsForums.com do not permit the linking of competitors products or websites. While we fully understand that there are a multitude of products on the market this forums function is to serve as an extension of our sales & support and as such is exclusive to our products.

 

Light discussion of other products has been allowed lately and will continue to be, but these topics are to remain free of links, pricing, or solicitation for PM or emails for the express purpose of selling/endorsing those products. They should also remain respectful of the fact that this is, in the end, AdamsForums and not an open detail discussion board for all brands.

 

Additionally, please understand that simply because Adam's does not currently offer a particular product it does not mean we are unaware or ignoring it. In most all cases testing and development are happening behind the scenes. In order for a product to be added to our line it must meet a number of criteria:

 

[*]It must perform to our standards

[*]It must be easy for even novice Detailers to use without error

[*]It must add some benefit over other/existing options

[*]It must be made in the USA

[*]It must make sense financially

 

Only under these conditions will we approve a new product for sale. Sometimes this means a slightly slower development cycle or that a particular product has to be placed on hold until we are comfortable adding it.

 

Rest assured our entire team is always playing with new products, competitors products, etc. If you ever feel there is a product we aren't aware of, a product you're curious why we currently don't offer, or just think you have found something no one else has seen yet please email SUGGESTIONS@ADAMSPOLISHES.COM or TIPS@ADAMSPOLISHES.COM

[JBlack151]

A great reminder, and very well said Dylan.

[ArmyAcadia09]

Good deal! and I've seen the testing area....Dylan doesn't lie

[Ralfy]

Rodger that!!

[3PedalMINI]

this is in direct correlation of the autoscrub thread, and after a few comments from the adams team has me really questioning...The final comment in that thread left a REALLY bad taste in my mouth, i really dont like how that thread or ANY thread regarding competitors products has/have been handled. Especially that one

 

you guys have an incredible FREE focus group right here, I would think you guys would LOVE to watch and listen to these threads and let them run their course, only to be closed when name calling and the maturity level drops. IMO that thread had some great constructive criticism from more the a few forum members.

 

Again this is my opinion, I do have a really bad taste in my mouth and I really dont like it. Ill continue to support a few of adams products and respect the rules but I do use other products that are far superior in there aspects

 

Carry On

[zxgto06]

^well said.

[gencoupe3dot8]

Brendon,

Try getting banned for a week for mentioning info on competitors product... no link.. banned with no warning...

 

I have seen a movement to blame the person questioning a product, rather than take a good listen to the user, a hallmark of those representing stellar customer service through feedback...

 

Adams, as they continue to grow, will have to decide how to handle these issues, and how tight a reign they will attempt to hold on the forum members, especially while touting USA freedoms, etc. Last time I checked the First Amendment still was in force... but doesn't look like that is honored here on the forum.... more of a dictatorship... and one that for me is becoming increasingly hard to stomach.. especially given the money I have spent with Adams, and the good will I have expended here.... Also moderation is best consistent, so banning for a week without warning for mentioning a competitors products seems draconian and not in keeping with stated guidelines... again you have all the power... and I have none... save that of my voice... much like our forefather fighting tyranny...

 

Sure its Adams mod team's ball game, but lest they forget, the forum is funded by dollars from us.. their customers, and we do have the freedom to vote with our feet...

 

As to this being strictly a support forum, I don't buy it. Adam gets the benefit of the goodwill of the community, while allowing no discussion of competitive analysis, EVEN IF IT FAVORS Adams.... this has been a kinder, gentler forum, in part due to the goodwill of the members... the increasingly draconian moderation by staff and volunteers has taken a lot of the "shine" of the forum for me.

 

Let's see what happens as a result of me exercising free speech...

Edited August 26, 2012 by gencoupe3dot8

[Green Machine]

Wow!!! This is some powerful stuff the last couple of days. Mike with regards to your statement that this forum is strictly a support forum I agree it's not! We Are allowed to post our pets and our homes and our families and our cars and our favorite songs! We talk baseball and recipes. Well you all get the drift so this forum is not just for support it is for us to share ours lives with fellow members! We also ask for prayers sometimes when we are put into situations we really don't need to be in!!!! All kidding aside sometimes I feel like big brother is watching. We as Adams customers and users are one of Adams best assets to spread the word!!! Which any car nut knows we do!!!!! And ask for nothing in return!!!!!!

Well I don't know if I really made my point but as a conclusion I think we can all learn something from the goings on here lately and I think both sides have to change each giving an inch at a time not I give an inch and you take a foot and vice versa! "Well that's all I got to say about that "as the immortal Forest Gump has said.

[Green Machine]

Oh I forgot something. If we can post about all that other stuff good and bad why can't we state our opinion about other produts in the detailing industry and also about Adams products good or bad! Just my opinion and I believe some powerful info that can be used somewhere down the line.

[3PedalMINI]

thats another good point tony, I have brought countless number of people to Adams and i know others have too. Its not just one person that your telling "if you dont like it you can go somewhere else" your telling 10-15 people that.

[lawson4450]

im not sure what some of the complaining is about i have been on several forums and these guys are not draconian to me. In my opinion it is an adams forum so respect it they let you talk about some other products but they ask that you dont post links and such i dont think thats a big deal. if your not sure about something ask the moderators in a pm and then talk about it but i think even though yes we talk about other stuff on here it is mainly adams products and support if people didnt have a chance to talk about their personal lives too this would be a bit boring not to mention we try and keep a family atmosphere here and like all families we have tiffs it happens just be adults and carry on. You can agree to disagree sometimes its ok.

[gencoupe3dot8]

Dan,

You get banned for a week with no warning? What do you call that, pantywaisted? Listen, I Admin a forum with 15,000 users, and we show tremendous latitude with our members. Now we don't use the forums as a way to market products, but to build relationships. This is the power of social networking. So far the goodwill of the members continues to drop money in Adams pocket. Time will tell if Americans with ever decreasing freedoms and paying an inordinate share of the tax burden in this country will continue to have their freedoms stripped from them! If we don't speak out we deserve whatever treatment those that seek to control us mete out to us, either here, our jobs, or from our government. I would think you would be familiar with the "don't tread on me" coming from the NE!

Edited August 26, 2012 by gencoupe3dot8

[3PedalMINI]

Dan,

You get banned for a week with no warning? What do you call that, pantywaisted? Listen, I Admin a forum with 15,000 users, and we show tremendous latitude with our members. Now we don't use the forums as a way to market products, but to build relationships. This is the power of social networking. So far the goodwill of the members continues to drop money in Adams pocket. Time will tell if Americans with ever decreasing freedoms and paying an inordinate share of the tax burden in this country will continue to have their freedoms stripped from them! If we don't speak out we deserve whatever treatment those that seek to control us mete out to us, either here, our jobs, or from our government. I would think you would be familiar with the "don't tread on me" coming from the NE!

 

well said

[Team Adam's]

Mike,

 

When we're you banned for a week without explination?

 

As I remember it you (not the first time) sent a lengthy email to Adam expressing your unhappiness with the end of our last contest, which also expressed your decision never to come back to the forum. No ban was issued that I'm aware of, other than your self imposed vacation.

 

Was there another recent time where your account privileges were revoked without explanation? I'm just trying to clarify bc we don't issue a ban without a reason and communication to the person being banned.

 

Edit- fixing typos as I try to respond from my phone.

Edited August 26, 2012 by Dylan@Adams

[Jonothon]

Righteous indignation is fun but pick your battles. If you really like a non-adams product, then vote with your pocketbook and buy it. If you don't like the way the adams forum is being run, then vote with your feet. We all have a number of forums that we visit and adams has the right to have certain rules and guidelines. Afterall, his name is on the masthead. This is as American as it gets. You have the right to participate or not and the right to buy or not buy what you want. If you want to praise a product that isn't adams, then go to that products forum and extoll its virtues. If you want adams to carry the product, then pass the suggestion along.

 

I know we are passionate about detailing but lets take a step back, ok?

[F150]

thats another good point tony, I have brought countless number of people to Adams and i know others have too. Its not just one person that your telling "if you dont like it you can go somewhere else" your telling 10-15 people that.

 

Name ONE person you introduced to Adams haha.

 

God I love these products.

[jwright0291]

I think that as long as a thread stays productive and mature, there is no reason to close it until bashing on either party has started.

[Marylander]

Ok, imagine some guy opens an Italian restaurant. You've heard they have great lasagna, so you go in and try it. And sure enough, you love it.

 

The chef comes out and thanks you for your business. "for you, my friend, 10% off everything on the menu, anytime you want!" he says. And he's always there for you, recommending wines to go with dishes, suggesting side orders, taking back dishes you don't care for and comping you dessert for your troubles. Sometimes he hosts big parties at his expense just so you and your friends can enjoy the same great food. What could be better?!?

 

On top of all that he says, What else can I do to make my Restuarant your favorite place? But then one time you're sitting there at his table and you say "your food isn't all that great. There's another place across town and their spaghetti is so much better. And the local steakhouse has French Fries, which you don't." The restauranteur says "thank you for the feedback, maybe we could change our spaghetti recipe a bit, but we're not going to add French Fries to the menu -- that's not what we do here." And he never says you should eat French Fries, he just says that he isn't going to start making them. He has his reasons; maybe it's the trans fats or maybe it's because his kitchen isn't set up to prepare them, but either way his restaurant won't be serving fries. "if you occasioanlly want to enjoy fries, my friend, go to the other guys place sometimes," the owner says. " I like fries, too -- no hard feelings."

 

That all seems like reasonable discourse. But you don't like the reply you got, so you stand up on the table in his crowded dining room and yell "this place is terrible! They don't want me to have French fries! I think French Fries are better than Garlic Italian bread! I'm being wronged! WRONGED!" and you go on and on, complaining every time you're in the restaurant. At this point of course the busboys start to notice and they're not happy about the disturbance you're constantly causing -- you always seem to leave an extra-large mess at your table that they need to clean up. The staff asks you to please keep your voice down; they're trying to maintain a fun, friendly, family environment, yet you persist. The owner invites you into the kitchen to talk, but you prefer to badmouth him in the main dining room. Soon enough the maitredee no longer wants to give you a table. And because you keep on being belligerent -- slandering the staff and food over and over -- a bouncer has to be called to keep you from coming in the door.

 

So ask yourself... Does the above story seem unreasonable from the point of the restaurant? Have anyone's First Amendment Rights really been violated? And honestly, who's the root of the conflict in the situation?

 

Do you see the point Dylan, the staff and the mods are tring to make? I personally fail to see how what we are doing here to keep Adam's great is in any way unreasonable.

 

Thanks for taking the time to read my silly little analogy.

 

Rich

Edited August 26, 2012 by MarylandTDI
Fix a few typos

[BRZN]

Nice analogy Rich, well put.

 

Good seeing you Friday too.

[gencoupe3dot8]

Mike,

 

When we're you banned for a week without explination?

 

As I remember it you (not the first time) sent a lengthy email to Adam expressing your unhappiness with the end of our last contest, which also expressed your decision never to come back to the forum. No ban was issued that I'm aware of, other than your self imposed vacation.

 

Was there another recent time where your account privileges were revoked without explanation? I'm just trying to clarify bc we don't issue a ban without a reason and communication to the person being banned.

 

Edit- fixing typos as I try to respond from my phone.

 

Dylan,

The ban started on or about 7/23 and lasted through 7/30. I knew a ban was in affect due to the banner I got about telling me not to mention competitive product. Trust me, as a forum admin I know what a ban looks like! That you didn't know about the ban I find a little worrisome, as the admin for AF.

 

I would have to review that email, but I did express unhappiness regarding the forum moderation, as I have in the past. I took the ban as a response to my email to Adam.

 

I fully realize this is your game, your products, and the power rests in your court... I think you will continue to have a challenge on your hands regarding the tension between growing a community built on the good will of its members and what I see as somewhat draconian censorship policy.

 

Again, I helped build a support organization that was the main reason our company rose to the top of its market segment, with revenue around $200 million and the reason for our success was our focus on the customer.

 

You have stated this is a support forum. I have submitted it has grown well beyond that, and to a large degree because of the goodwill of its members, who often suggest both product and the forum to family and friends.

 

The reputation of the forum (and Adams) will to some degree rest on how successfully you resolve the tension between keeping the members captive (the no linking policy), keeping the perception that Adam's products are the best in the industry given the price range (the no competitive information policy) and allowing the product, your knowledge, and the brainpower of the members to come to the conclusion that Adam DOES offer a superior product -- hands down and bar none.... and still allow members to share knowledge with each other, and where Adams products OUTSHINE the competition!

 

I want to thank Adam, yourself, Adams employees and members of this forum for revitalizing my interest in detailing...

 

Happy detailing,

Mike

Edited August 26, 2012 by gencoupe3dot8

[Watkins]

This has gotten out of control in every aspect. A good product speaks for itself, so if Adam's products are really superior to those of its competitors, than it shouldn't matter what an existing Adam's customer explores outside of Adam's products. If a competitive product is really inferior to a comparable item that Adam's offers, than that customer will have learned a lesson and find his/her way back to Adam's.

 

 

I feel like Adam's employees openly talking down a competitive product just drives more people away. If you don't want people to buy a specific product, than talk up your own product, don't talk down about the competition. Keep it classy.

[LDM]

I love Italian food, but I don't think my diet could consist entirely of it. However, I do know this really great Italian restaurant where the service is great and I've spent A LOT of money over the past few years. The owner really seems to care and often comes out to greet and take care of his customers himself. This restaurant is so great that I've told a bunch of friends about it and whenever someone asks where to get Italian, it's where I tell them to go.

 

I also know of some steakhouses though, and to think that their food and service can't be as good just because they don't serve spaghetti is kind of silly. The owner seems to know this, and will sometimes make references to steak himself, but whenever a customer happens to mention steak the waiters are quick to tell the customers how much better spaghetti is. Even if a guy likes both and asks what's the best steak to go with this awesome spaghetti is, he is quickly silenced, or sometimes even hidden from the other customer's view. The waiters' view is that spaghetti MUST be served with meatballs, and any opinion other than that is wrong. Everyone knows that spaghetti and meatballs go together, but that doesn't meant that spaghetti and steak might work out just as well for some people too. He shouldn't be badgered into getting the meatballs by the waiters when he already ordered the spaghetti.

 

Now I completely understand that it's wrong for someone to come into the restaurant raving about how much better steak is. They definitely shouldn't be allowed to hand out flyers about steakhouses. However what's the harm of mentioning steak? Why should the best Italian restaurant around get so defensive about it? They've created an environment where customers are made to feel ashamed about even liking steak.

 

One nice thing about this restaurant though is that sometimes they add new things to the menu. One customer happens to mention a dish that some other restaurants offer and wonders if anyone's tried it. Despite a lot of good reviews from outside sources, one waiter is quick to point out that he heard about someone getting sick from it one time. The spaghetti isn't broken, so why try to fix it? Everyone should just stick to the spaghetti. Well if this is the official view of the restaurant, what if I want to try something new?

 

At this point the head chef comes out of the kitchen yelling at everyone about how little they know about what goes on in the restaurant. He's already tried all variations of the recipe and none are fit for the restaurant. For proof, one of his buddies had tried a few bites back at his place one time. We then are told the chef has been cooking for a long time, and has done so at a much higher level than the rest of us. Now I know I'm not the greatest cook and would never challenge myself against the chef's abilities, but that doesn't mean the chef should belittle my cooking. I try hard in the kitchen at home and have fun doing it. Next we are told that if we don't like everything the waiters say we should just get out, and at that point the kitchen was closed.

 

The next day this whole event was censored and we are simply reminded not to talk about steak. Now I had a lot of respect for the chef and right before he came out of the kitchen to yell at everyone I had even praised how he is usually quick to help anyone if they have an issue with their order. However, one bad experience can keep a customer from going back to a restaurant even if they had enjoyed themselves there in the past. I may have an unpleasant experience with the waiter one day and still come back because it doesn't represent the company as a whole, but the chef represents the core of the company. If that's the way things are going to be, should I try to find a new restaurant?

 

Now I love coming to this restaurant. The food is great and the service top notch. The customers are friendly and we can joke around and talk about all kinds of things even if it isn't food-related. I'd like to think that I've helped a few people figure out the menu over the years, even though it's not my job to do so. Of course I'm not an expert like someone who's been cooking their entire professional life but if you spend enough time somewhere you can pick up a few things. And while I'll won't name steakhouses here, or tell someone that they should get a steak instead, if a waiter tries getting someone to order something off the menu that they might not need, I may remind the customer that there are other ways to get a full stomach. Out of respect for the restaurant I won't give specifics, but if there's no balance to the propaganda some people may go their whole life without enjoying a steak thinking Italian food is the only good food. As someone who enjoys food, I think it's perfectly fine to support multiple restaurants if they all provide good experiences.

 

Lately Italian food has been leaving a bad taste in my mouth. It's not the food itself, but how defensive the restaurant is of the food. I can't understand why they feel so threatened if they truly are the best Italian food around. It's that attitude, not a problem with the spaghetti, that makes me want to try the steak even more.

[Green Machine]

Wow!

[3PedalMINI]

Wow!

 

Yeah, that is probably one of the best written paragraph's I have ever read

[Bill-V8V]

Great read, now I'm hungry and i've been trying to lose a few pounds :o:o

[LDM]

And just to add, we don't know what it's like for the restaurant staff. We don't get to see what happens in the kitchen, and maybe some of the employees were just having a bad day. Maybe they're just fed up with a few customers that have been difficult. I'm sure it can be frustrating when you put so much of your own effort into something that you can become overly sensitive to anything negative mentioned about your work. But while us customers may need to see things from the restaurant's point of view, I think the restaurant may need to look at things from a customer's point of view as well. Just because a customer likes steak doesn't mean he won't continue to eat spaghetti. Maybe the mention of steak in their restaurant might make them feel insecure, but if they stepped back they'd realize that the customer is still eating and enjoying the spaghetti, and will still come back for more.