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Am I Expecting Too Much?

GLBL WMR

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GLBL WMR

GLBL WMR

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A few weeks ago I used the PC with FMP (white pad) and the MSW (grey pad). I was so pleased with the results and swirl removed in the garage under the halogen, but the next day, I go it out into the direct sunlight, and if the sun hits some spots directly, you can see tiny micro scratches (like the SHR and orange pad would leave, but to a lesser extent) in the pattern of how I made passes with the PC. Its not something that the normal person would probably notice unless they were looking for it. If you're looking at it from an angle, it looks great. I can't get it to come out correctly in a picture..

 

Is this normal for black, or am I doing something wrong? What would be the least aggressive way to fix this the next time I polish/wax?

 

I thought my personality could handle black, but I guess I'm learning otherwise. My next car will be a metallic, for sure...

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Fit08

Fit08

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I can promise you that absolute perfection is possible on black cars using that exact combo... is it realistic to maintain that, not really, but its possible. If you think switching to a hand routine over the PC is going to remedy the problem I'd first suggest visiting a physician and getting yourself a prescription for muscle relaxers and a heavy pain killer b/c your shoulders are gonna HURT trying to get the paint perfect by hand!! LOL.

 

The foam composition of the applicators used in the hand routine is identical to the foam used in the machine pads, the products are similar, so your basically taking out the speed and consistency of the machine and replacing it with your arm, thats not going to remedy the problem.

 

Black can be very discouraging, but with some refining to your process you can get to perfect... I just warn you that aiming for 100% perfect all the time is going to drive you batty!! Getting there will take tons of work and concentration, then in a moment it can all be ruined so just go in with your eyes open. Also keep in mind, black paint is no different than any other paint job other than the fact its easier to see the defects... a red car having the same problems as you would be able to spot that defect as well in full sunlight, they'd just be a little harder to spot.

 

 

 

 

Excellent way of putting it!:2thumbs:

 

DD and I'm in the 80-90 % paint correction camp. good enough!

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dumbmoran

dumbmoran

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Indeed,

 

I'm sure the pigeons roaming the skies above love to leave their mark on your vehicle as well as Mr. Layer of Dust.

 

The first can't be avoided, but how do you keep the second nuisance to a minimum?

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Junkman2008

Junkman2008

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I've just started working on the hood of my dark car and it really takes alot of effort to do this correction the first time. I worked a third of the hood for about 90 minutes with just SHR and its still not perfect. It really boils down to patience and hardwork - to me its all about the fact that you are slowly removing these imperfections because if you could do it quickly you could also easily mess up the paint. Adam's instructions were spot on - I had been using alot more product and alot less pressure and going alot faster across the surface. I think I've started to improve my technique though - I just need to get in better shape so I stop passing out after each 24" section. :D

 

On a side note, once you get it perfect you really have to be careful. For the longest time, I believed that all microfiber towels were the same. Just last night, I took a microfiber towel that I bought from Wal-Mart (with one of those little tags on it that says Made in China) and scrubbed it on a section of the car that I had already completed. I did the same thing with one of Adam's New Double Soft Premium Microfiber Towels. After just a few seconds of rubbing, the Wal-Mart towel was already marking up the surface with fine scratches. I scrubbed even longer with the Adam's towel in the other spot and no sign of any scratches ever appeared. I'm a believer now - correct it, protect it, and then don't dare mess it up again. :)

 

There's this guy on this forum, I think his name is Junkman... he preaches the same thing you just said. I guess there may be some truth to what he says.

 

I'm jus' sayin'... :D

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LinPark

LinPark

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I've just started working on the hood of my dark car and it really takes alot of effort to do this correction the first time. I worked a third of the hood for about 90 minutes with just SHR and its still not perfect. It really boils down to patience and hardwork - to me its all about the fact that you are slowly removing these imperfections because if you could do it quickly you could also easily mess up the paint. Adam's instructions were spot on - I had been using alot more product and alot less pressure and going alot faster across the surface. I think I've started to improve my technique though - I just need to get in better shape so I stop passing out after each 24" section. :D

 

On a side note, once you get it perfect you really have to be careful. For the longest time, I believed that all microfiber towels were the same. Just last night, I took a microfiber towel that I bought from Wal-Mart (with one of those little tags on it that says Made in China) and scrubbed it on a section of the car that I had already completed. I did the same thing with one of Adam's New Double Soft Premium Microfiber Towels. After just a few seconds of rubbing, the Wal-Mart towel was already marking up the surface with fine scratches. I scrubbed even longer with the Adam's towel in the other spot and no sign of any scratches ever appeared. I'm a believer now - correct it, protect it, and then don't dare mess it up again. :)

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Chewy

Chewy

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Agreed! AJ needs dialog lines to make sense of him...

 

lol

 

He's right though... Read as well as watch.

 

Remember these guys show it and it looks easy but what you don't see is the "feel" they have for it now. It's an art not a science.

 

Chris

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Junkman2008

Junkman2008

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Yes, I did, Junkman. I'm RacerE7773 on youtube. I'll give them another look.

 

Speaking for my videos only, make sure that you are not just sitting at You Tube and watching the videos. The videos originate here, and here is where you will find information about each video that may NOT be IN the videos. Thus, when watching my videos, start in my forum (The Junkman's Corner) and watch the videos on You Tube but READ THE THREAD where they are posted. The videos make MUCH more sense that way.

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Adam

Adam

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Perfect black paint is achievable! Thanks for your business, and the photos of the Camaro trunk look like the standard first time results with a PC. (That's before watching videos.)

 

Here is how to get perfect paint!

 

Get a test spot perfect first, 24" square or so.

 

Use the Orange Pad, Swirl & Haze remover. Setting 5, then move to 6 after several passes. Press hard. Pad should NOT spin at 5, and barely at 6. It should take about 20 seconds to go 24" across a panel.

 

Leave residue on, go to White Pad, and FMP. Repeat above, first 5, then 6, going very, very slow.

 

Better? Please report back!

 

-Adam:thumbsup:

 

:pc:

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Team Adam's

Team Adam's

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I can promise you that absolute perfection is possible on black cars using that exact combo... is it realistic to maintain that, not really, but its possible. If you think switching to a hand routine over the PC is going to remedy the problem I'd first suggest visiting a physician and getting yourself a prescription for muscle relaxers and a heavy pain killer b/c your shoulders are gonna HURT trying to get the paint perfect by hand!! LOL.

 

The foam composition of the applicators used in the hand routine is identical to the foam used in the machine pads, the products are similar, so your basically taking out the speed and consistency of the machine and replacing it with your arm, thats not going to remedy the problem.

 

Black can be very discouraging, but with some refining to your process you can get to perfect... I just warn you that aiming for 100% perfect all the time is going to drive you batty!! Getting there will take tons of work and concentration, then in a moment it can all be ruined so just go in with your eyes open. Also keep in mind, black paint is no different than any other paint job other than the fact its easier to see the defects... a red car having the same problems as you would be able to spot that defect as well in full sunlight, they'd just be a little harder to spot.

 

DSC_4980.jpg

DSC_4979.jpg

DSC_4978.jpg

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GLBL WMR

GLBL WMR

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Its just as likely that those short scratches are the deepest portion of the original swirls. I've started to see a lot of this when people jump straight to FMP... each swirl on your paint is going to have variable depth to it the FMP might be enough to take out MOST of the swirl, but the little bit left in the end is too deep for the FMP to touch.

 

Not saying thats 100% your case, but it could be. I'd do as Junkman suggested and take on a test section with SHR & the orange pad. Even run a line of tape that crosses over some of those defects, complete the process on one side, pull it back out into the sun, remove the painters tape and do a side by side comparison.

 

This is definitely not the case, as these micro scratches are not at all consistent with what the car had prior in terms of swirls. These scratches are definitely a result of my work - I have seen similar threads on here during my research where the SHR/FMP/PC combo results in micro scratches that are only visible at certain angles in the sun on black cars. There seem to be some people on here who just aren't pleased with the PC on black cars, and they just end up going the hand route.

 

Junkman - I'm not at all trying to be a smarta**, but if FMP is used to correct the small amount of damage that SHR leaves behind, why would it instead create damage that wasn't there in the first place (like how SHR beats up on the clear a little)? It just seems illogical to me.

 

I was using the 4" pads because it's all I had at the moment - maybe the combination of the 4" pad and too much pressure caused it. I'll do a small test area with the SHR and then the FMP right away and evaluate the results. But if I'm not seeing the results I want, I'm just going to go back to hand polishing, which I assume would eventually correct my issues over a few polishes.

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