quick sealant and friction?

[diver88]

ok, I finally got around to using the quick sealant. I washed the car well, dried it without using detailing spray and it still passed the baggie test so I didn't feel it needed the clay bar treatment. I watched the video (Dylan) on how to apply and went after it. it went on very easy, and after a few minutes I wiped it off with a single soft towel and I noticed it cleared really easy but also I noticed as I was wiping it away I was building up a lot of friction as it got harder to wipe.

 

it's been over a year since the machine sealant, buttery wax and a bunch of detailing spray... should I have done an IPA strip before this quick sealer, could that be why I got the friction and a required correction?

 

the car has 4350 miles on it and is garage kept, and I have this belief that if you experience friction to the point the single soft drags and feels warm, something is going to swirl, and it did. to the touch the paint feels otherworldly slick so this makes no sense at all.

 

to make sure I didn't dream all this up I have a brand new set of polished aluminum wheels that I waterless washed and I applied the quick sealant to last night. using a single soft to wipe down, same thing... the towel started to sort of drag on the surface while wiping down.. I waited an hour and applied a dusting of a second coat.. after wipedown they were very shiny and slick but had visible swirls in the clearcoat.

 

what's up, what could possibly be happening here?

 

thanks for your help..

 

[Team Adam's]

Immediately after QS application you might notice some increased drag... after its fully settled out and cured you'll notice its VERY slick. Perfectly normal experience

[Redbeard]

I haven't had a problem with this. What's the typical cure time for QS?

[Team Adam's]

Only takes a minute or 2 to "cure" but it can feel a little grabby for up to a couple of hours after application. It won't happen to everyone every time, but its not uncommon... I've even experienced it a few times usually by the time I'm done cleaning my applicator its slick.

Edited November 21, 2012 by Dylan@Adams

[diver88]

ok, make sense Dylan.. but should I have waited longer to wipe off, use detail spray as a lubricant to wipe it off? the "grabby" feel or "drag" as I described translates into friction and it seems to swirl things up, how do I keep that from happening? wrong humidity levels, temperature?

 

great stuff, it's just the chicken and the egg here, I polish to correct, I seal to protect.. then I polish to correct............................

 

thanks.

[Team Adam's]

There shouldn't be a whole lot of wiping needed unless you applied it too heavily. For the mostpart just a pass of the towel is all thats needed... the product somewhat self levels so theres rarely much to 'remove'.

 

Maybe you went too heavy on the application.

[Kenneth]

Well me and quick sealant don't get along either. On my black truck I spray some on the hood for instance spread with the applicator and then I get blotchiness and unevenness. It's a PITA to spread evenly and to get where it looks right again. I have done my truck several times and it always happens. It's like the sealant only sticks to certain places as they are really dark but it comes spotted unless I wipe down multiple times.

[Team Adam's]

Well me and quick sealant don't get along either. On my black truck I spray some on the hood for instance spread with the applicator and then I get blotchiness and unevenness. It's a PITA to spread evenly and to get where it looks right again. I have done my truck several times and it always happens. It's like the sealant only sticks to certain places as they are really dark but it comes spotted unless I wipe down multiple times.

 

Have you stripped, clayed, and polished the areas prior to applying?

 

Keep in mind I tested and developed Quick Sealant while I still had my Avalanche, so I made double sure it worked well on black b/c thats what I had to test on.

 

Doesn't get much 'blacker' than this:

 

[Kenneth]

^^^ I still like that truck better than the new one

 

Well I stripped washed and clayed but haven't polished yet. I'm site it's something I'm doing wrong but it seems to wear my arms out when I do the whole truck.

[Team Adam's]

Another idea (if you don't polish) is to wipe down with a 1:1 isopropyl alcohol (IPA) mix... sometimes strip washing and claying isn't enough to completely remove previous sealants or waxes from the finish.

 

The IPA is a way to make sure its all off... I suspect it might be something on the surface already. Also remember its optically clear, so if you see blotches you probably went a little heavy. Don't spray right onto the paint.... spray onto the app and then spread... this keeps it thinner and more even.

[diver88]

There shouldn't be a whole lot of wiping needed unless you applied it too heavily. For the mostpart just a pass of the towel is all thats needed... the product somewhat self levels so theres rarely much to 'remove'.

 

Maybe you went too heavy on the application.

 

could be, I sprayed it on the pad then very lightly misted the hood. 3-4 minutes later wiped it off. came off pretty easily, I flipped the towel and wiped over it again to make sure I got it all and that's when it got "grabby". maybe I should have stopped after one pass(wipe) then 30-40 minutes later used detail spray to wipe it off?? I will say it wasn't as "grabby" on the wheels after the first coat and 30-40 minutes cure time. maybe that's the key. very light coats, don't overwork it, go back later...reapply.

 

I used the wipe off single soft just to wipe over the hood on my pickup the next day after I washed it, did not apply any more product to the second vehicle and the hood feels and looks like I applied product. so just the fact it was used to wipe down the first vehicle was enough to seem sealed.

hmmmm, that's a very light coat.

[Kenneth]

Thanks Dylan. Well next strip wash I'm going to be using the flex and MSS but quick sealant on my new chrome wheels really went on easy and looks great. I'm going to keep using the QS and ill figure it out eventually lol.

[diver88]

There shouldn't be a whole lot of wiping needed unless you applied it too heavily. For the mostpart just a pass of the towel is all thats needed... the product somewhat self levels so theres rarely much to 'remove'.

 

Maybe you went too heavy on the application.

 

like I said, maybe.. I thought I replicated what I saw on the video.. but one thing still doesn't add up. on a clean surface, sealed with quick sealer should any amount of wiping (a couple of passes) with a clean single soft towel lead to swirls and micro marring? this seems like you can't touch your paint without doing some form of damage. I thought using the proper products were safe, thus you improve the finish, I'm missing something here.

[Team Adam's]

I guess I'm confused as to what the issue is that you're having... you mention sealing polished aluminum wheels, but then have swirls in the clear coat? So whats swirling?

 

The paint on your car? The aluminum on your wheels? or both?

[diver88]

I guess I'm confused as to what the issue is that you're having... you mention sealing polished aluminum wheels, but then have swirls in the clear coat? So whats swirling?

 

The paint on your car? The aluminum on your wheels? or both?

 

the clear on the car, and the clear coat on the new aluminum wheels.

sorry that was confusing, I did talk about both.

[Team Adam's]

I'd say start by scaling back how much you use... the most common mistake people make is laying on too much product.

 

Also give it a little more time to setup.

 

Lastly, if you're scrubbing at it with enough force to cause damage to the paint you're working too hard... even with it 'dragging' slightly on the towel, that isn't an indication to press harder and scrub more... just leave it be. It will smooth out on its own.

[diver88]

thanks Dylan, trying to get to the bottom of this. over the weekend I washed the car again and after it was dry I looked closely under bright lights and it looks like there's an uneven film that's sort of spotted. not sure but it looks like the sealer "mist" (tiny droplets) set up before I wiped it down and didn't smooth out. this doesn't really make sense though but possibly it seems like this already partially set up sealer was what made it a little stickier or grabby. I wasn't rubbing hard, just enough to keep contact with the car. I think I went pretty light on the application (watched your video a few times first) but maybe 3-4 minutes set up time was too long.

humidity, lack of, left it on too long, little too much product.. don't know but just trying to figure out what went wrong where it doesn't happen again.

 

when the car was clean I wiped lightly a clean single soft over the finish and it was slick but I could hear the towel on the clear like if you did a baggie test to check for needing a clay job. when I sprayed a little detail spray it was super grabby, I know wiping that was too much effort and would result in damage.

 

I glazed the car, then applied buttery and it was super slick and shiny but just don't look too close for damage.

 

next nice Saturday I'm going to wash and clay, then fine machine polish.. then try the quick sealer, glaze and buttery or americana. hopefully that'll clear it up.

[Team Adam's]

Keep in mind the product self levels to a great degree (if applied appropriately thin) so the need to wipe much of anything is minimal... in some cases you may not see any residue to remove at all.

[BRZN]

Just a thought here and going to throw in my .02 since it not been addressed yet.

 

The towels, how old are the microfiber towels? Are they always cleaned properly? Try boiling a couple of the towels you'll be using next time before you use them. Boil them in a large pot of water with a cap full or two of Distilled White Vinegar for 10 minutes. I get the "grabby feel" when it's time to boil my microfibers.

[diver88]

Just a thought here and going to throw in my .02 since it not been addressed yet.

 

The towels, how old are the microfiber towels? Are they always cleaned properly? Try boiling a couple of the towels you'll be using next time before you use them. Boil them in a large pot of water with a cap full or two of Distilled White Vinegar for 10 minutes. I get the "grabby feel" when it's time to boil my microfibers.

 

mine really haven't been used much, and always washed in cold water with Woolite, double rinsed, dried in the dryer on "air fluff" only, no heat. after I first experienced this I dug out a brand new/never used but washed once towel and same story. there is a film on the clearcoat after I applied the sealer, too heavy?, adhered to previous wax and detail spray, not wiped off fast enough, too much or too little humidity, not shaken well enough (I did have it over a year never used) I don't know... but I'm going to have to do a IPA strip, clay, polish, seal, glaze, and wax to see if I can get past this.

 

currently it's really slick but not close to perfect sealed, glazed, buttery wax but if you spray detail on it you have to work very hard to get it off as the towel just "sticks" to the finish and you have to scub it to clear it.

 

every time I touch it, I damage it further....I guess I have to get that film off before anything will improve.. it'll probably look darker and clearer too.

 

thanks for the suggestions.

[Team Adam's]

Personally I find that woolite is a losing proposition for cleaning microfiber. Its designed to be gentle, but in that same vein its terrible at removing polish/wax residue from the fibers. Meaning each time you use you're towels they're less effective.

 

I know certain people have touted the use of woolite for microfiber based on their knowledge of 'doing laundry' but its just half baked info. Woolite is not ideal for removing product residues essentially designed to resist detergents like wax and sealant. Essentially leads to the need for either more frequent boiling or replacement of towels. If you look at it in terms of what defines a durable/good wax or sealant it the longevity of the product (i.e. "Can it withstand multiple washes?") so essentially using woolite to clean your towels is like using our Car Wash alone to try and strip wash your car... it won't work. Its a gentle cleaning agent, it won't break down the stuff thats in the towels.

 

Use a dye free/perfume free laundry soap... don't worry about using something that is 'gentle'. You need to get the product residues OUT of the towel fibers. The other option is to do a good cleaning with our Microfiber Revitalizer & Brightener more often. Unless you're cleaning silk blouses, leave the woolite on the shelf.

Edited November 27, 2012 by Dylan@Adams

[diver88]

maybe that's part of my trouble. on many occasions I've sprayed them with all purpose cleaner to cut through the excess wax, detail spray etc.. wouldn't that remove the residue you speak of or is APC damaging to the single softs?

they feel really soft, and smell clean.

 

also, a suggestion on a specific liquid soap to use?

[Team Adam's]

maybe that's part of my trouble. on many occasions I've sprayed them with all purpose cleaner to cut through the excess wax, detail spray etc.. wouldn't that remove the residue you speak of or is APC damaging to the single softs?

they feel really soft, and smell clean.

 

also, a suggestion on a specific liquid soap to use?

 

APC won't damage the towels... as a matter of fact a pre-soak with APC is specifically recommended in the FAQ thread I just updated:

 

http://www.adamsforums.com/forums/microfiber-products/14121.htm

 

Feel and smell are fine, but its virtually impossible to know whats buried deep within those tiny little fibers with just a touch and smell test.

 

As far as suggestions... I use All Free & Clear HE (i think thats the name) but any standard laundry detergent will get the job done. Just need to pay attention to 'allergen free' or 'dye perfume free'.

[diver88]

that's really good to know, but with washing multiple times and using APC my towels have got to be pretty clean since most have never seen sealers, polishes or waxes...most have only seen detail spray but I'll search for the "free and clear" laundry detergent for future washes.

 

now I still need to clear that sealer "film" off the clear coat that seems to be causing my problem. like I said, I switched to clean, unused new towels and still had the issue.

 

thanks, we'll get to the bottom of this eventually.

[Team Adam's]

Strip the panel with a 1:1 mixture of isopropyl alcohol.