Dylan@RUPES

Replied to your PM.

The LHR75E Mini works great as a sander... we actually pair it up with our X-Cut foam backed abrasives for spot sanding of painted panels. It will be perfect for headlight restoration work paired up with the right abrasives. GO FOR IT!

IMO, the Duetto an equivalent to the Porter Cable DA, though it is smoother and better balanced. If you are looking to upgrade look at the Rupes LHR 15 Mark II. It is an upgrade in orbit size, power, & smoothness, and still uses the 5.5/6" Adam's pads.

The duetto will run circles around the PC - while the chassis might have a similar style, don't forget the Duetto has a 12mm orbit vs 8mm on the PC. Much more torque as well.

All coatings "allow" waxing... there isn't a ban on it

The issue is that the hydrophobic nature of the coating would be compromised by layering a wax over the top... the primary reason you would want a coating on the paint of your vehicle is its ability to shed contamination and moisture from its surface. Inhibiting that feature somewhat defeats a large part of the primary purpose of applying a coating in the first place. A quality coating product from a reputable manufacturer is going to be FAR more hydrophobic than a wax could ever hope to be... add to that the fact the wax itself would behave like a surface contaminant and the coating would not allow it to adhere very well to the surface.

It would be like taking your non-stick frying pan, and applying something to it that made things more likely to stick. Just isn't logical.

the rupes 15 has a larger stroke than the cyclo? I thought the stroke of the cyclo was 15.875mm correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that's right out of the manual. that would give the cyclo the edge in the stroke department . Add the fact that u can put pressure on the cyclo vice 0 pressure on the rupes , the gap lessens even more in terms of correction power .

You are correct. After re-reading my post I can see where I mis-spoke (posted)

When I said larger I meant in relation to common tools on the market, not the Cyclo specifically. It would have been more clear to say LARGE orbit, not LARGER orbit.

In terms of pressure - not sure I understand your statement there. For the optimal performance of both machines pressure should be minimal. The BigFoot tools are designed specifically NOT to require downward pressure, pretty much only the weight of the tool. The Cyclo is the same. Excessive downward pressure rarely offers much benefit to a polishing operation and causes fatigue for operators.

Long story short - if its a race for complete removal of a defect in identical conditions the LHR15II will be the faster machine due to its operating speed and torque delivery.

EDIT - disregard. I have everyone now... you goods will be shipping today. Cheers!

Actually it was my picture lol

My bad - the owner of the photo takes the prize, but maybe we'all include the quoted post too bc I'm feeling generous

Yes please

Reflection pic posted! Thanks!

Nice Shine Buddy

I'll play along.

 

Split shot of my old truck.

Heres my 5 picks! If I quoted you above shoot me an email: dylanv@rupesusa.com with your

1) full name

2) your screen name here on AF

3) complete shipping address.

We'll get these mugs, keychains, and maybe a couple other surprises on their way to you.

I had a feeling Dylan might chime in

Hey... part of the benefit of working in the building where both the Cyclo and now the BigFoot 15 and 21 are built for the US market. No bias in my opinion between these tools, they're all part of the RUPES family now

Might not be an Adam's mug, but I'll be happy to give away some RUPES mugs with BigFoot keychains. Post a reflection shot, I'll pick about 5 of my favorites and send you the mug free of charge.

The LHR15II is going to give you a substantial upgrade in cutting power compared to the Cyclo.

Now don't get me wrong, the Cyclo is a great tool and does a fantastic job, but its strongest attribute is its balance. Really its the only tool on the market that can claim lower vibration levels than the BigFoot family, but the higher OPM and larger stroke of the BigFoot 15 means it cuts faster and finishes clean.

It really comes down to what your goals/needs are. If you want something to do the bulk of the work faster than your Cyclo can then get a 15 Mark II. If you find yourself needing a tool for tight areas and edgework get the LHR75E Mini (it'll run the same pads as your Cyclo so thats an added bonus).

No idea. Haven't used the product.

There are dedicated panel wipes that are far more capable of preparing a surface for coating than any soap could be.

Stephen,

 

Dylan over at Rupes explained this in a far better way than I could. I am not sure what brand you found that is rated a 9H. I'm assuming it was a high priced coating?

 

Dylan,

 

Thank you very much for your explanation. I couldn't even pretend to have as much knowledge. I know that some manufactures create a coating that turns so hard, that they say you have to wetsand to remove any highspots (After it has fully cured). This just sounds like a bad idea from the start. Since AP doesn't currently manufacture a coating, can you tell me if the CQuartz UK edition, (They claim better performance in cold weather) is a good choice. I did recently buy this coating, but I haven't applied the coating yet. I have a 12 month coating on now and I want to apply in Spring.

There are dozens of coatings already on the market using the 9H claim already, its not uncommon. Some even have gone so far as to claim "HARDER THAN 9H" which is somewhat amusing if you know the pencil hardness scale. Anyways - its not a new marketing tactic, its mostly BS that the seller knows the average consumer won't go do the trouble to prove/disprove.

Certainly that is true, my point is this - there is no standard by which coatings are measured and a pencil hardness test is easily manipulated by the coating thickness. If you do the deep dive with some of these products, and assuming they even actually did the test and will provide the information the 9H rating only comes in at a thickness of 25µ or more which is an unrealistic thickness to recreate on the paint of a vehicle. At the more realistic level of 5µ the hardness evaluation can drop by 4 levels or more.

Again - red herring.

Facts - can a coating provide increased resistance to light swirls and marring? Absolutely! Does a claim of 9H make one coating harder than another? Absolutely not unless both coatings are compared at their ACTUAL applied thickness for a set number of coats for the comparison.

A coating might not have prevented this, but certainly minimized the damage. I know Adam's Polishes would be new to the "coating" game, but I highly doubt the first version would have a 9H hardness. Not necessarily because they can't, but with a coating this HARD, it certainly wouldn't be user friendly. Most coatings that achieve this type of hardness can ONLY be removed by wet sanding! I guarantee that if AP releases a product like this we would see: Ease of use, 12-18 months of protection, Under $75 price point (I hope). 

Don't get sucked into the pencil hardness evaluation of coatings, its a red herring. Its a topic thats far more in depth than what I'm going to get into here, but the long and short is the "9H" claim thrown around by so many products is effectively useless as its not validated and honestly has very little real world benefit due to the low amount of film buildup by most products.

I don't think the link worked.

 

SWA (supplimental wetting agent) - I noticed you said you used a detail spray to wet the pad. Not sure where this recommendation came from, but wetting Microfiber pads is not advised. You decrease engagement quality of it soaks into the backing, you increase saturated weight which exaggerates a lot of conditions and produces a better migration of heat... And if the Detail Spray contains wax it can impact your cutting power.

 

This is from dylan

Getting quoted all over this thread. LOL

I'll leave AP policy for best practices with their products to the AP team, however the statement above was made specifically in relation to an SWA and its use with the AP pads. That rule is not true in all circumstances with all types of MF pads.

To further warp your noodle - what if I told you an SWA with some polish and MF pad combos actually INCREASED cutting power significantly. Weird right? Its true and demonstratable... if youre ever in an area where we're conducting a BigFoot polishing system class pop in and we can cover the concept.

Im actually a tech at the dealer, I leave the detailing to the guys out back. They are using standard rotary polishers and hex type pads. I honestly have no idea how they work around the badges, I assume its by hand application. 

They should be using a Nano

Test in a small, inconspicuous place regardless of what you try.

If the 'detailer' used something with a heavy solvent in it there is a chance it isn't a product that is making it sticky, but the actual laminate layer of the dash itself thats sticky - softened by the chemical they used. An aggressive cleaner will only make matters worse if thats the case.

I don't know the Porsche paint process as intimately as other makes, but another possibility is tinted clear.

It's not unusual for an OEM to use a pigment tinted clear as a top coat to give the paint a different dimension.

Not a coating:

http://74.124.22.133/products-services-sentinel.php

http://74.124.22.133/pdfs/sentinel_FAST_FACTS.pdf

 

The appearance products are a PTFE (Originally Developed by Dupont) based liquid that applies a seal to treated surfaces.

So they're selling under the 'dupont teflon based sealant' shtick - which has been talked to death, but long story short is a lot of snakeoil in a liquid application as it requires a baking process of 450*... so unless that dealer has a very big oven the 'teflon' isn't doing much. 

Depending on the composition of the coating some can be lightly polished... most will be completely removed by even the most mild abrasive actions however.

Since it was "applied at the dealer" I'm going to go out on a limb and say its not a coating at all. He paid for one of the 'paint protection' programs which are typically a very basic sealant with an insurance policy tied to it. I can count on one hand the times I've seen dealer applied coatings and in almost all of those cases it was sub'd out to a detailer locally who was installing opticoat, cquartz, or similar territory protected products

The trigger lock? No real trick - just pull the trigger all the way, press the lock button, release the trigger and it's locked on.

Pull the trigger again and release to stop.

People falsely get intimidated by the eraser wheel and assume it'll damage paint easily - fact is that the wheel is quite safe to use if you follow the tips provided above. Just keep it moving. The material is designed to crumble and fall apart as a dust as its worn away (like a pencil eraser on paper) so the potential to damage to paint is actually quite low.

The only real chance for damage is from high heat and thats if you hold the thing in one place for a long time or apply pressure to it. If you stop frequently to check temp, keep the wheel moving, and don't press hard even the most unskilled person can use one safely.

I've lost count of how many badges I've removed with the wheel, full pin stripes, etc. On the black AP dually I removed a stripe that ran the entire length of the truck - think of that... a crew cab, long bed dually. Did the entire thing with 1 wheel in an afternoon and not a bit of damage.

Don't let the fear mongers plant seeds of doubt, it really is the easiest way to remove the badge residues.

Thats definitely an unusual issue there, but I suspect under-cured or improperly mixed paint in a respray.
 

Tell me this: if you were to press the edge of your fingernail into the paint would it leave a mark? If it does you're probably dealing with an under-cured or poorly mixed paint that didn't have the right balance of hardeners or some other issue.

As others mentioned - you won't damage anything, especially with the Cyclo, so you can be confident in starting on the Porsche. Short of flipping it over and using it to beat your car the Cyclo isn't capable of damaging it.

If you're still hesitant there's no better practice car than a rental. It's guaranteed to have horrible defects, will cost you less than $50 a day in most cases, and the $9 insurance will give you coverage in case of freak polishing accidents.

There's also the fun of returning the car fully polished and watching them try to figure out why anyone would detail a rental car